After Setting Trapout

Discussion in 'Swarms, Cut outs, and Trap outs' started by Iddee, Jan 17, 2010.

  1. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    Once the trap is set and all entrances are thought to be closed, I try to spend from 1 to 3 hours with the homeowner. Explaining bees, traps, what they should do and some things that may be a problem. I try to teach them enough that they will check the trap and call me 2 or 3 times weekly. The assistance from the homeowner can vary from nil to doing everything you ask and some have even bought the hive when I finished.

    Either by returning myself, or from the homeowner, I want an update on the trap the day after the set up, then once or twice weekly thereafter. I am looking for a mass exodus, where the cone is packed with bees trying to exit all at once, and are getting out, not a blocked cone, or a full day with no bees leaving. If the latter, it means we missed seeing the first. When either happens, I wait 3 or 4 days, then remove the cone. I will explain to the homeowner that they will see many bees returning to the house, but they are only robbing the honey out. Call me when they do not see a be go in the house for a full day. I will then check it myself by observing flight for an hour or more. If the bees are traveling to and from the field, with no action at all in the house entrance, I will seal the entrance and remove the new hive.

    If at any time, the catch box has 7 or more frames of caught adult bees, I will remove it and install another, either with a queen cell from the first one, or another frame with eggs. I have gotten as many as 4 hives and a nuc from one trap.

    MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!!

    This will be the last post in my series. I'm sure I have left out many things that need to be said, so I will answer any questions anyone may ask, if it is within my experience. I will also add posts, or modify these, if and when I think of things I have left out.
     
  2. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    i was asked to remove some bees from a 200 yr old brick home so i said you're exaggerating about 200 years of course. The reply was NO joking. This probably means old brick outside, old plaster inside and small spaces between. Access is through a hole where a brick is missing. Hoping to vacuum them out but as i haven't seen the job yet am not very hopeful. So i ended up here and this is the best trap post i've read. If i may ask: There is a board to be put up to mount the cone to? eighth inch hardware cloth for the cone and not metal window screening? The cone opening should be as close as possible to the hive box i want them to go into? There NEEDS to be some brood comb WITH eggs in the new box? Anything else i should know? Thank-you VERY much, JL.
     

  3. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    There is a board to be put up to mount the cone to?
    There are photos in one of the 5 posts.
    eighth inch hardware cloth for the cone and not metal window screening?
    Yes, 1/8 in. Window screen will collapse and block the exit. 1/4 will allow the bees back in.
    The cone opening should be as close as possible to the hive box i want them to go into?
    The cone opening can be anywhere. The catch box should be as close to the base of the cone as possible. The bees are trapped on their return from the field, not on exit from the cone.
    There NEEDS to be some brood comb WITH eggs in the new box?
    Absolutely YES! They will not enter the box without brood to attract them, and they cannot raise a queen without eggs.
    Anything else i should know?

    Be sure and read all five trapout posts. They are all important.
     
  4. G3farms

    G3farms New Member

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    Sounds like you have a good trap out job ahead of you. Be sure to seal up all of the other openings that the bees can use for entrance/exit with silicon caulk (check inside of the house also). If the brick of the house is uneven you will need to seal around the plywood cone holder also.

    Let us know how things are progresing!!

    G3
     
  5. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    I will let you know - supposed to look at the job tomorrow (Friday, May 12) JL.
     
  6. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    Went to have a look and its really old brick like the lady said, uneven too. No bees inside but outside there is a 2x4 framed porch roof, metal roofing, with a brick missing in the first row above the porch metal and another directly below it. Both holes are half a brick long so there is about a 4 inch wide by 7 inch high opening and the porch frame only an inch (or less) from the brick wall. Here's my initial plan: Cut a several feet sheet of plastic with a hole with less than a foot to caulk to the wall with the hole centered over the opening, caulk to be around both the perimeter of the hole and the perimeter of the sheet. Next make a one eighth thick board with the cone attached and feeding the escaping bees in a downward direction since the roof seems marginal in strength. Caulking applied before attachment of the board and some wooden wedges between the board and porch roof framing to hold it in place. My theory is that this should eliminate any openings for the entire area covered by the plastic except for the one in the cone itself. I'll set the hive box on a temporary platform to hold its entrance close to the cone BASE. Hope one of our earlier Warres has a top bar with some brood and eggs it can spare so i can swipe it for this project.

    By the way, i can see NO pictures on any of the four linked trap out posts. (Using Firefox 3) (doesn't work for me in IE8 either) But i sure do appreciate the info you have given.
     
  7. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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  8. onehorse

    onehorse New Member

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    Can you explain why a trapout works? Why can't they figure out how to go back through the cone? Are you looking to set the trapout up so that when the new forager bees take their first orientation flights, they orient on the opening of the hive box and not the end of the cone? We just set a trapout up over the weekend, it seems to be working, though the older foragers seem to be diehard to get back into the hive and won't follow the cone. We set it up so the cone was angled in towards the hive box, but off to the side of the entrance.

    Thanks!
     
  9. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    You do not trap them when exiting, as they are on their way to the field. You trap them when they return and cannot get back in, so they are attracted to the brood smell in the catch box. They are accepted because they are loaded with nectar and pollen.

    They cannot see the shape of the cone, only square fencing. Therefore, they cannot find the opening. Put a solid funnel in place of the cone and they will find the opening and continue living as normal with a new entrance.
     
  10. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    Well, i tried the plastic idea sealed around the perimeter and around the hole over the entrance in the brick wall. Then wedged in the plywood with the exit cone attached. Very difficult to do as there is an approximate one inch gap between the porch roof framing and the brick wall. Because of the difficulty of being on a steep and very short porch roof coupled with the skinny gap at the wall many bees were trapped under the plastic and the number seemed to be increasing - hmm. So we had a general consensus that there was indeed at least one way in/out under the semi-clear oval tarp. Also many bees gathered just to the right of the tarp as well. I squeezed clear silicone in all the suspicious spots i could find and decided to wait it out and see. That was yesterday. Other concerns kept me from checking back there today and tonight, tomorrow and the next morning call for rain. But i figured they would need a while to figure there was no exit from under the tarp. I'll try to get back there as soon as a dry day is available to see how it all looks to my keenly untrained eye! Thanks for all past and future responses, JL.

    P.S. Got my filter peeps to unblock photo bucket - very helpful pics, thanks! :)
     
  11. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    Went back a couple of days ago and found many dead bees under the plastic :(
    Guess they weren't able to make it back in or else there just wasn't a way back in. Cannot be sure. There didn't seem to be any activity in the bait hive which had a small top bar comb with larvae and eggs. Called the lady to see what she had to report and she said she HAD seen bees going in and out so i went back again the next day (an hour drive) and saw many bees on the landing board and some activity as far as bees going in and out. Encouraging. BUT . . .
    It looks like the bees are having a go at returning through the small end of the funnel! Its only about seven sixteenths of an inch! If i find this next trip out i intend to squeeze it closed a tad more. SO it SEEMS to me that the news is good. Thanks for your interest and comments.
     
  12. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    Missed many other openings in an area away from the first. This must be a rather large colony. Sealed up all i could find and will be returning soon to set up a new trap. Last cone got full of two-way traffic and was a deadly disaster for the bees. The opening was big enough for two bees. This is far from where i live which makes it more difficult to monitor. The new Warre hives should be well able to lend a better bar of drawn comb. Hope there is still time to get them all. JL
     
  13. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    Ended up removing the trapout, cleaning the target hive, cleaning up the mess and once again looking for and sealing other entrances after vacuuming the outside bees to take to another hive as there were just too many bees to adequately assess the situation. Work delayed my subsequent return but when i did get back it SEEMED there were NO bees! Built a support for putting the collection hive closer to the next cone (on the slanted roof of the porch). Upon returning to the site with the remade cone and hive support for the roof i found four tiny entry points farther down the wall and sealed these up. Only saw four to six bees in the hours i was there this time. I cleaned out the seal between two bricks i KNOW had activity before and installed the new cone there with the tip less than a foot from the collection hive landing board. My daughter wondered if the clogged cone might have contained the queen, dead along with the workers packed in there. Good question. Anyone have an opinion and/or advice? Hoping to get back to the site within a week to see if there are ANY signs of bees inhabiting the collection hive. Oh yeah, we put two fully drawn bars of comb in the hive from a well developed 4-box hive and sprayed honey bee healthy inside and lemongrass oil on the landing board. Worst part will likely be cleaning off the caulking from the bricks and mortar. Tried a couple of spots from the plastic attempt and it doesn't come off well. Kudos to GE's silicone products. Bummer, JL.
     
  14. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    IF, and I say IF, you were using 1/8 inch screen, or hardware cloth, with the exit large enough for 2 bees, I have never seen one get clogged. I have never seen one packed solid with bees EXCEPT when the queen left. They don't leave "en masse" unless she goes. If the tip clogged with 3 or 4 bees, the rest should back up into the house, not pack in and die, If there were hundreds dead in the cone, I would say the queen was likely in there, too.
     
  15. JL_COG

    JL_COG New Member

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    Sorry for the delay, some serious family issues have been pressing. I'd say the missing/dead queen theory makes sense. To sum it all up we cleaned it all up, set a new trap out just because for the sake of just in case but didn't expect anything to change. After two weeks and no change and no bees we dragged up all our stuff and cleaned up as best we could, settled up and went home. It was overall quite the experience. Learned some more about the science and art of loving bees and tried to be a good testimony for beeks. Thanks for all who helped and encouraged, JL.
     
  16. lesterp

    lesterp New Member

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    Do you feed a trap out? Thanks
     
  17. G3farms

    G3farms New Member

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    You can, but at this time of the year (but not sure of your location as far as what kind of flow is on) I would not, but then there is much stuff in bloom right now around me. Just remember that all of the bees that are leaving the original hive are foragers and will be returning to the hive with pollen and nectar.
     
  18. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    With new bees coming in every day, I would think they don't have guards set up. Feeding may cause neighboring hives to rob.