American imports.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by alleyyooper, Feb 1, 2010.

  1. alleyyooper

    alleyyooper New Member

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    Just think of all we import we once did for our selves. Oil, cars, tractors and other farm machinery, tainted honey from china, tainted pet food from china, toys for our children and grand children painted with lead paint, tools from china and india, doctors from India, party store owners from the middle east, workers from mexico and clothing from asia, lumber from eroupe, veggies from mexcio and south america. Really a shame that the biggest commie loosers are Cuba and Russia. And of course the very biggest looser is Americans. We now borrow money from other countrys, we spend it in other countrys (for their products) at an alarming rate now too. We also send billions upon billions of dollars to other countrys as aid too.

    Appears there is to much greed on the top side to do what we once did our selves.

    Feel free to add to the list of things we did our selves we no longer do.

    :mrgreen: Al
     
  2. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    Although I do agree with you, I don't see any possible way to discuss it without bringing in politics and ending with a tg like thread, so I'll just sit on the sideline and watch. At the first sign of anger or ruffled feathers, tho, I will have to close it.
     

  3. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    lurking also...
     
  4. sqkcrk

    sqkcrk New Member

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    Is it greed or just intelligent economically? Don't corporations have a duty to their stock holders to do what they do in a manner which maximizes profit while minimizing expenses?

    I know that iddee has been involved in business. Where are mattresses made and why? Why aren't there anymore sewing factories in NC? Or no where near as many as there used to be anyway.
     
  5. alleyyooper

    alleyyooper New Member

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    "Don't corporations have a duty to their stock holders to do what they do in a manner which maximizes profit while minimizing expenses?"

    While the above statement make makes a bunch of sence it isn't true. As a stock holder in a major corapration at one time I know that stocks have set earnings of so much per share. They can make major profits for several years before the board can/will vote for a increase in stock dividens. In my case the company had a rate of 75 cents a share per quarter for over the 15 years the stock was still good. Should have sold the stuff at 70.00 a share but figured the company was in fine shape untill I woke up one morning to see on the news the stock had drouped to $2.40 a share. Since I had bought at $41.00 wasn't any way I was going to sell then. Then the company declared bankrupsy, that stock is usless now, won't even make good TP as the paper is to stiff. I don't even think there is enought to get a good fire started, OH WELL we learn.

    As for the politics, It wasn't ment that way. Just setting down and relizing we don't make much in this country any longer. Relizeing that CEO's, make huge wages and bonuses some times at the companies well being due to those parachute clauses.

    :mrgreen: Al
     
  6. barry42001

    barry42001 New Member

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    There once was a time when American Industry was interested in thier profits, and used those profits to both enhance themselves, and then the employees, this in turn enriched the local economies, by having workers with the cash in pocket to buy what other industries built also inside USA. That promoted loyalties that extended well beyond mere industrial wealth. Now with most industries based off shores, their money in offshore banks, and concerned only with satifying stockholders even at the expense opf the buisness itself, nevermind the workers, one can well envision why employees have no loyality to the product they make-either they can't afford it or don't want it knowing how is made. America is rapidly becomming a service economy, with almost NO heavy industry, and why--stockholders want thier profits, to hell with the country that provided them with the ability to make all the money, that they are now making.
     
  7. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    As I said, I do agree. Textiles was once the backbone of the south. Now they are practically non-existent. Those that remain are only a stateside office or distribution warehouse for an off shore operation. Why??? Because if you and I see identical shirts in the store priced at 9.99 and 124.99, we are going to buy the 10 dollar one. Then we aren't going to work for 6.00 an hour when we can collect 12.00 an hour welfare.
     
  8. Mama Beek

    Mama Beek New Member

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    I don't know a whole lot about the subject but I do know how sad it was when my husband couldn't find any work for quite awhile.... he finally took a job, but it was a temporary job taking down the equipment in a factory and loading it on trucks to be shipped to the new factory in Mexico. How sad that we are literally loading up our jobs and sending them south and importing employees to take the jobs that are left here!
     
  9. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    a sqkcrk snip..
    s it greed or just intelligent economically? Don't corporations have a duty to their stock holders to do what they do in a manner which maximizes profit while minimizing expenses?

    tecumseh:
    at one time it was corporate ethic by those in charge that you were bound to 1) uphold the interest of stockholder 2) look after the interest of their customers and 3) make certain the employees were treated fairly.

    now the only ethic seems to be by those at the top is to grab all the loot (yep plain as day looter to me) they can and make certain someone else is holding the empty bag at the end of the day.

    a corporation that was maximizing profits and minimizing expense would never conform to the ethics profile in paragraph one.

    from a more practical point of view anyone interested in maintaining a corporation over time would know almost instantly that maximizing profit and/or minimizing expenses is an incorrect posture if you want the corporate entity to survive over the long haul.

    if you really wanted to maximize profits and minimize expenses you would choose the illegal drug trade or perhaps gun running as the preferred business plan. in either of these business options you need not worry about the stockholders, the customers or the employees.

    the black cat goes back to lurking...
     
  10. alleyyooper

    alleyyooper New Member

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    During WWII indurstry moblized and built what was needed to win the war, in some cased a month or two. I wounder if the same could be done today as fast as back then.
    Many of the buildings are being torn down from back then. In my area along GM has torn down the old Buick City assembly plant and the Old AC Spark Plug plant. there are also a lot of what were littlesupplier plants that are now gone. Appears once the buildings are gone the taxes on that land goes down too.

    $124.00 for a shirt? Ya I can see that but if buying a 12.00 American made shirt or a 10.00 asian shirt I go with the American one.

    :mrgreen: Al
     
  11. Mama Beek

    Mama Beek New Member

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    I bet it could be if more folks had the right set of priorities :shock:
     
  12. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    A shirt has 60+ sewing operations in it. Compare 21 cent per hour seamstresses to 12 dollar per hour seamstresses and tell me again that there will only be a 2.00 difference in the retail price.

    And that doesn't include the difference in cloth and thread manufacturing cost in using china or American made materials.
     
  13. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    mamabeek writes:
    bet it could be if more folks had the right set of priorities

    tecumseh:
    I think that might be the point?

    Then again even with good intentions if you haven't the skill or the resources you are not going to show much success in an endeavor.

    I like to make the point that between 1939 and 1945 we built the atomic bomb from scratch. Fast forward 50 years later and it takes 5 to 6 years to retrofit a hummer. what does that tell ya'?

    Iddee writes:
    A shirt has 60+ sewing operations in it.

    tecumseh:
    I would 'guess' that would depend on the complexity of the shirt? It is also good to remember that labor ain't the only cost involved in producing something/anything. often time it ain't even the most costly item on the bill. of course slave labor will always be cheaper than employing free men and women.

    the current reality is (from what these old eyes have seen) is that the interest of international corporation is now more important than the interest of this countries breathing citizens. at the current point in time these same international corporations also have a larger political voice than you or I.

    I would toss in Mussolini's (the father of) definition of National Socialism but Iddee might accuse me of going a bit too political.
     
  14. Sundance

    Sundance New Member

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    A consumption based economy is doomed for failure. We need
    to get back to production. Textiles, steel, etc. Those were the
    living wage jobs of the past.

    It seems to me that the service industry that serves consumption
    just doesn't offer a living wage.

    In short.......... LESS imports......... MORE in country production.
     
  15. sqkcrk

    sqkcrk New Member

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    Before you know it we will be importing more food than we produce for ourselves. All the while we are subsidising producers of corn syrup and cotton, but not real foods such as vegetables, fruits and grains other than corn. Our Ag Subsidies Bill is hurting not only ourselves, but other countries that produce some of those same products.
     
  16. Mama Beek

    Mama Beek New Member

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    I totally agree! But then you also get into the whole "living wage" conversation. I have a lot of my own personal opinions on the way that it seems most folks want to live these days but to me it seems possible that a lot of the jobs left because who in the world CAN afford to pay what most people started calling "a living wage" and still run a profitable business?

    Once upon a time a man (or woman) could take a job in a factory and live a decent life within their means and support their family on the wages that were offered. They spent a portion of what they earned, saved some, and retired with a pension. A person could go from a young age, raise a family, and retire without ever changing jobs. That kind of stability you just can't find anymore. Now most families need to have two adults working full time + and farming their children out to the state subsidized babysitting facilities just to keep from going bankrupt while supporting their two new car, new house, new furniture, new electronics all on credit habits. The living wage became an unattainable, unsustainable goal when people decided that they could no longer practice delayed gratification, and realistic goals while raising their family and teaching those values to their children.

    Ag subsidies aren't for the purpose of producing food for us :shock: Their main purpose is to support the growth of the Ag industry....Monsanto and friends. I agree that it hurts everybody, everywhere. I thought that we already did import more food than we grow....especially produce. We also import beef, fish, honey, tea, coffee....and the list goes on and on. Our list of food exports has shrunk year after year, and because of the Ag industry many countries will no longer accept many of the foods that we do export.

    The skills to produce our own goods by and large already exist in this country....it's the "want to" that is lacking. Since long before I reached the age of adulthood people who actually worked for a living, got dirty, or didn't have an office job were criticized and discouraged. From elementary school on children are indoctrinated with this attitude that they should go out and work at an office to get the money to buy all the stuff they want, and if that takes too long max out your credit cards. Like I said.....it's priorities.
     
  17. BjornBee

    BjornBee New Member

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    A good start would be in our very own backyard. We import more and more honey each year from overseas. Yes, we have a serious supply side problem, as we just do not even produce enough for our own needs.

    It's a two issue problem. We really can't diss the imports (unless they are tainted) when nobody has honey sitting around going unused anyways. Many times, those that comment about stopping imports, are usually more interested in prices going up.

    Beekeepers, just like every other area of production, needs to support grassroots efforts, sustainable agricutlure, the farmer down the street, as well as every other small American business.

    One of the main focus points of the national honey bee day program, is the direct support and marketing of local honey and bee products. This of course flies in the face of the much seemingly well respected other businesses and organizations focused on importing as much as they can.

    It takes effort to seek out U.S. made products, and actually support those making the effort. They usually are not the one's handing out fliers, coloring books, promoting large scale programs, and paid with collected fees, and by the market "profits" of the very thumb they control the markets suppressing the small producer.

    Problem is...we do not produce enough. But change the demands...and supply will follow. Educate the public to the benefits of local honey. It is better for you, the bees, and the economy. Our part is to actually make sure we start producing what the demand is. And right now, we are far below the demand. If that happens, we have no right to complain with imports.

    It is not just about thinking about steel mills and factories. It is about making everyday decisions of where your buying dollar goes, who it supports, and the ramifications.
     
  18. Sundance

    Sundance New Member

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    My fiance is in the management end of a large Food Coop in
    Mpls.

    She has opened my eyes to the "local" foods issue and I am
    happy she did.

    Sustainably is the bottom line with not only food, but all goods.

    Get to those farmers markets!!
     
  19. cow pollinater

    cow pollinater New Member

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    I finally got fed up about two months ago. I'm self employed but I represent a company with American in its name which buys promotional products from another company with America in its name... Every stinkin' peice of clothing on the site is made in Cambodia, China, Indonesia...SOOO, I went on a little internet shopping trip and have found an entire wardrobe of either US origin or US product assembled in Mexico. I don't mind trade with Mexico as much since if we create jobs for them in their own back yard it helps us. I'll be buying all US made clothes at least until our unemployment rate gets back to the low single digits. :thumbsup:

    Value is set by the consumer. If we express a desire for US produced products, retailers will provide us with US based products but it is entirely up to us as consumers to demand it.
     
  20. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    cowpollinator writes:
    Value is set by the consumer. If we express a desire for US produced products, retailers will provide us with US based products but it is entirely up to us as consumers to demand it.

    tecumseh:
    a common misunderstanding (somewhat express previously in notations of $ labor cost) is (kind of a basic rule in economics) there is only a very weak relationship between consumer price and cost of producing anything. the more layers there are to the distribution/marketing the weaker the relationship. I wold guess if you did some kind of survey on the street and ask what the full $ cost of producing this or that little item most folks would be absolutely stunned to find out how far off there guess really is..

    sqkcrk writes:
    Before you know it we will be importing more food than we produce for ourselves.

    tecumseh:
    well in $ terms this has been true for about a decade.... which is to say we import a lot of value added agricultural product (wine, cheese) and only sell raw agricultural product. as suggest a lot of this export is likely only possible due to a certain level of subsidized prices.