Brand new. Need a little guidance

Discussion in 'Beekeeping 101' started by juntjoo, Jul 24, 2017.

  1. roadkillbobb

    roadkillbobb Member

    Messages:
    171
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    18
    the problem you may have is the bees wont have time to make a new queen because they need day or 2 old larva to start feeding royal jelly to make a new queen and make a queen cell..because you are ripping apart their home to move, they wont know whats going on for a few days and then the brood may be too old to make a queen..any bees out of the hive will return to the old column as thats the only home they know,this has nothing to do if a queen is present or not in the new hive, you can set up a box with some of their comb right by the column and hope the returning bees go into the box and then you can transfer them into the new hive and location.. the bees that are in the hive will care for the brood and get the new hive in order, but without a queen the hive will die off..brood will hatch out in about 5 days..so in a week or 2 if you see new brood in the hive the queen made it, if no new or any brood in a week or 2 then most likley the queen didnt make it, your only option would be to buy a queen to keep the hive going or let it die out..
     
  2. Gypsi

    Gypsi Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    2,552
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I'm hoping someone got to rubberbanding comb into empty frames before we got to royal jelly. will try to check in again tomorrow. when I'm awake
     

  3. juntjoo

    juntjoo New Member

    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Nope but is that how you initially secure the brood/comb within the frames before they figure out how to build into them?
     
  4. roadkillbobb

    roadkillbobb Member

    Messages:
    171
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    18
    they dont have any problems building comb,they know how, and once they start building it you will see they love to build comb..everywhere..lol..you will scrap alot of it away when pulling frames and checking the hive..save all that wax..its worth more than the honey.. by rubber banding the existing comb with brood and honey is that it doesnt go to waste and the bees will have a head start in a new hive and will want to stay to take care of their brood and have food on hand...and best of all if you can find and mark the queen and put her into the new hive box, that will help insure the hive continues on..
     
  5. ccjersey

    ccjersey Member

    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    8
    You want the queen in your new hive.....or you want her dead. The bees will go where her pheromone is. If she dies for whatever reason, the colony will figure it out pretty quickly (within an hour or so) and they will probably act like most swarms, look for the best new home they can find. Having their brood combs and some small honey and pollen stores banded into the frames included in their new hive will tend to make them stay. If you have them shut up in the hive for a couple days (in full deep shade at this time of year!) by the time you let them out, it will be home to them.

    So smoke them to keep them calm and gently collect bees with piece of cardboard, drywall mud knife etc and dump into new box. Have some frames out of the middle that you have removed foundation to band the combs of brood primarily into. This makes it easier to dump bees into the box. As you get each frame filled mostly with comb, gently set it in the box so any bees under it can move out of the way. The same goes for moving the frames sideways and snugging them together to make room for putting in more frames, do it slowly. Probably will not get 10 frames in the box without crushing/rolling bees as you put the last one in. Go with what you can get in without smashing them together.

    Put a top on hive, if you have lots of bees left outside, place it next to the old site so the lost ones can collect on the outside of the box because the queen is (hopefully) in there.

    If the "lost bees" do not collect on the hive, you don't have the queen. Maybe try again tomorrow to get more bees out of the old site and put them into the box with the brood combs. After a try or two, if they still want to stay in the old cavity and you have a lot of bees shut up in your box, I would move it (the new hive) away a mile or more and let them raise a new queen. You can open them up the first morning because they will have been shut in a couple days already. This will let them orient to the new location and begin foraging.
     
  6. ccjersey

    ccjersey Member

    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Cannot get site to respond so I can edit.......urg !

    If there are newly laid eggs in the brood comb you put in the hive (there should be) AND you do not get the queen in there alive, THEN the bees you have can select some of the larvae that will hatch on the 3rd day after they were laid and make one or more queens. They will realize they are queenless early on and should begin the process in time to have suitable 1 or 2 day old larvae to work with.

    Brood combs usually have a rim of honey on the top corners and there are usually areas of various pollens stored on some of the combs with brood or nearby. They do not need a whole lot of honey
     
  7. juntjoo

    juntjoo New Member

    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    I'm really busy now. Would it make it much more difficult later to move them if I let them camp out for a while and grow their comb?

    I've seen a few videos now and I think what I saw them doing was cutting the existing comb up in slices to make fit in the frames. Will I have to worry about cutting through sleeping babies and getting attacked lol?

    Also, I see a lot of attention and excitement on the queen. is finding her basically unnecessary confirmation the hive has been successfully transported? Can I just grab what I can, transport it into frames as carefully as possible, wait a day or so and most likely find everything has gone well? speaking of which, what's the risk I could kill her by squeezing or cutting? Obviously I'll be as gentle as possible.

    this time I'm going to just wear the jacket with hood. last time, my first time I dressed for winter and I'm in SWFL, but I noticed they only really went for my face, which has always been the case, so i'll take a change with my legs, maybe arms too. Thoughts? plus I like the idea of getting stung once in a while to exercise my immune system. maybe I've answered my concerns here.

    Thanks!
     
  8. roadkillbobb

    roadkillbobb Member

    Messages:
    171
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    18
    well, ummm, if you like bee stings, go at it..lol....for ripping apart a hive to transfer, I would be dressed for battle, if im just checking honey or filling a feeder after a little smoke I would do that with just a vail and gloves to cover your arms...why dont you learn how to ID the queen and then you can look for her and if you want spend a few bucks on a queen holder and paint pen so you can mark her when you find her...there is no time limit or best time to move them, either they will continue to build comb and thats fine, or they may leave...just for sh-ts and giggles, I would put the new hive with frames in it on top of the block with some lemon grass oil inside( the bees seem to love that) and see if they move themselves, you never know..I would think they wouldnt move , but you have nothing to lose..
     
    juntjoo likes this.
  9. ccjersey

    ccjersey Member

    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    8
    There are africanized bees in S Florida! I think you would know already if you had some, but they can move in and take over hives/cavities etc that were previously occupied by European strains of bee.

    Everything about moving them into a hive will be easier the sooner you do it. Less of everything!
     
  10. juntjoo

    juntjoo New Member

    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    thanks
     
  11. juntjoo

    juntjoo New Member

    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    so just take the existing comb and place it on top of the hive box after lathering up the frames with lemon grass oil? Would that be just to attempt to make it all easier avoiding having to cut the comb up? thanks again. and to remind you i'm totally new to all this and never wanted bees in the first place til I just recently decided it sounded like a good idea, so the responses here have been really helpful. I actually think once I do this I'll become a real bonafide amateur bee keeper! Can't wait to get some honey!
     
  12. ccjersey

    ccjersey Member

    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    8
    No, you would place your new hive with its frames and foundation inside near the existing cavity. The lemongrass oil is an attractant for swarms of bees and if they decide to move (abscond) from the column, they might move into your hive. Bees usually abscond for a reason, though that reason might not be obvious to the bee keeper. Absconding is not the preferred option for the colony because it involves leaving their brood and any stores behind. If they moved only a few feet, they could go back and move their stored food, but the brood would almost certainly die.

    As a swarm trap, I think placing the hive baited with lemongrass oil and used frames from other hives some distance away would be the preferred technique. Sort of wasteful to loose the use of a whole new hive just so some bees might move into it. Most folks use small boxes, plastic buckets, flowerpots etc that don't cost much to construct swarm traps that are baited with lemongrass oil and smelly old frames or just combs etc.
     
  13. roadkillbobb

    roadkillbobb Member

    Messages:
    171
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    18
    NO NO NO..LOL...geez this is getting to be like an abbet and costello skit....if you dont know who they are, you are showing how old you are..lol...ok .....this is a suggestion to your particular issue....if you dont want to mess with them now and move the comb to the hive thats ok( im located northeast we dont have any africanised bees so if that is a concern down by you then alter my suggestion..so you leave the comb as is, my suggestion of using some lemongrass oil in the hive is no to catch a swarm, but if your bees may just be enticed to take a look if you put the hive close to them.if you are moving the comb now forget the lemongrass oil, and if in a month or so you decide to move them and you did put the lemongrass oil in the hive, dont put any more and the existing will be no harm.thats all..that was not a recommendation to catch a swarm now and not with a full size hive..yes thay make swarm traps, I have several up, you never know when you may get a house guest..freebees no pun intended are the best...