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I'm sure there are 5G towers near me, so much construction going on. But so far my bees are fine
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
If I can trust the anti 5g movement the problem is that it doesn't kill them in a way that can be noticed early. More like a slow poison, it supposedly does things like weaken the immune system and damage dna strands. So by the time you notice the damage, it is so great that it can't be reversed.

The video is kind of extreme but there are two towers near each other so the bees are probably killed by an intense dose.
I think this needs much further research, we need to sacrifice some hives to test 5g radiation to keep the bees alive as a species.
If it is bad for insects in any way then 5g from orbit will devastate life on earth.
 

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I've seen this video:
It could be faked but I've read so much and there is this petition: BEEKEEPERS — 5G Space Appeal

Have you had any experience with bees and 5g towers?
The radiation coming from a 5G tower is the same as other cell towers, but it is at a much high frequency 3.4 GHz. This frequency doesn’t penetrate as deep and radiation would be felt as heat. Of course mice are the smallest animal tested, and they are certainly different from bees. To be honest, there has been very few health effect studies on humans and probably no long term study.
Bees are amazing insects and have many environmental protection methods. DNA damage and death would only appear after multiple cell divisions. Assume the radiation is felt as heat - there’s no reason to believe otherwise. Bees generate heat and are extremely good at detecting heat, so if they detect heat would they move away from the source? I’d say probably. Let me add a ‘study’ of insects and (microwave) radiation that may validate that assumption - you cannot kill an ant by micro waving it. Here's why. A kitchen microwave’s radiation is not uniformly distributed, and we thereforevuse a turntable to prevent uneven cooking. This uneven distribution has supposedly been demonstrated by microwaving an ant - without the turntable. No ants are sacrificed in this experiment because they move to a place in the oven with less radiation. Bees are smarter than ants.
Lastly, let me add one last fact. The 5G causes (fill in the blank) claim was first introduced on the internet by a Russian Troll farm. Someone probably earned their Star of Lenin metal for that one.
 

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Thank you FarmerDell for doing research I had no time to do.
If anyone is interested there are a large number of scientific studied of bees posted here.


Scientific, research base articles on bees.

- Did you bees understand the concept of zero?

- Bees use double stranded RNA to genetically transfer recently acquired immunities to the next generation? I.e. CRISPR. They were robbed of a Nobel Prize.

- During a debate among a group of waggling bees, they butt heads with a speaker as a way to tell her to “stop talking, we've heard enough of your arguments, let's get down to voting.”? Bees for Senate, 2022!

- There’s more. Farmer in the Dell
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
@FarmerDell Where are the 5g/microwave tests and studies? I can't find them in the link you provided. How do you know it was really russian trolls? Is there evidence on this? I don't give a cent on Hackers/Trolls news/opinion pieces those are the standard scapegoats for everything now. Also why is everyone just talking about heat? What if the frequencies themselfs are damaging? What about long term exposure etc. If shelled insects don't die in the microwave, that doesn't mean that they get out without any damage.

They use Microwaves to kill insects: Technology : Microwave will keep the weevils out of wheat
Even if grown bees are fine what about the larvae?






There are so many studies that show that microwaves can be damaging. So far I have not found any evidence that 5g is safe.
There is too much disinformation out there and it's common knowledge that politics and corps will push anything without any disregard on how damaging it is.
We need hard proof that 5g is safe! So far I have found only the opposite. As beekeepers you know how important our pollinators are.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
So I'm sold that EMF/EMR is destroying everything, I have found enough evidence. The disinformation is not comming from a troll army or hackers it's politics and corps that do the disinformation. Scientists provide hard evidence that EMF/EMR are dangerous.

Thus I've created this:
 

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The entire EMF frequency range is hazardous to living cells - from infrared to nuclear radiation. We use nuclear radiation to treat diseases because it destroys cancer cells. X-Rays are dangerous but are the staple of diagnostic medicine. The sun’s UV-C radiation damages our skin cells but it is also used to disinfect hospital rooms. Infrared can burn our skin but we use it to heat our houses. I can go on, and on - microwave oven, radio and television transmitters and receivers, and let’s not forget cellular telephones (2G, 3G, 4G, 5G, and 6G). Electric motors, automobile ignitions, baby monitors, electronic kids toys.

The differences between ‘good’ and ‘evil’ are Intensity, Time and Distance. Too much, too long, and too close is bad, so we make a deal with the devil. We know there is danger, but we embrace the benefits. (Don’t get me started on cigarettes and alcohol.)

With cellular, the phones are far more dangerous than towers. The standards for acceptable radiation levels have caveats as to where and how far away they are placed from a body and how long they are used. The standards are on the edge of acceptability. (Service providers encourage hands-free for a reason.) More importantly, a cell phone typically has two power levels - 0.6 watts and 3 watts. Be far away from a cell tower and you got 3 watts rattling around inside your skull. (A truckers CB transmitter is putting out 4 watts.) It’s counterintuitive but to make cellphones and cell towers safer, you simply build more towers.

As to our bees, I’m not saying Any-G is absolutely safe. I did find one research study reporting bees being damaged by cellular radiation. Of course their determination was made by bolting two cell phones inside test beehives. I’ve seen better designed studies in high school science fairs. So to be fair, let’s say it’s inconclusive , but it’s also a distraction from the real challenges bees are facing. They are not proxies for us. One in umpteen-billion bees may pass by a cell tower, they are not their problem.
 

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Whereas everyone I know owns and uses a cell phone.. And I wear mine in a pouch up against my body, maybe not the smartest thing to do, but it isn't actively doing anything when its in the pouch
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
I understand the concept of "the amount makes the poison" but I also understand it when scientists give warnings and I have found many now.

3 Years ago there were many wild bees around now I'm lucky if I see a couple a day. This is not normal. Elon is gonna bombard the whole earth with 5g at some point, there will be no escape for insects. There are very important pollinators that do not have hard shells, moth for example.

This is extinction level stuff. I suggest you read some of the links I have added, pretty much all of them are credible sources. One is even of a scientists that is also a beekeeper.
 

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Whereas everyone I know owns and uses a cell phone.. And I wear mine in a pouch up against my body, maybe not the smartest thing to do, but it isn't actively doing anything when its in the pouch
Not true. Your cell phone is continually checking in with nearby towers, saying “I’m here if anyone calls”. if you have a smartphone, it is being continuously sent emails, text messages, push-notifications. There are anecdotal evidence of women that placed phones in their bra developing breast cancer at the spot directly under their phone. As for men putting their phones in their pockets - oh, the horrors being reported. As I said in an earlier post, there is no harmless electromagnetic radiation. Of the four exposure factors (wavelength, power, distance, and time), we control the length of time and distance from our bodies. Use that knowledge wisely. [I know of no studies of phone enabled Apple watches - those we strap to our arms 16+ hours a day.]
On the positive side, a phone’s EMR is probably less dangerous than distractive driving - or walking into a pole or in front of a bus.
 

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I understand the concept of "the amount makes the poison" but I also understand it when scientists give warnings and I have found many now.

3 Years ago there were many wild bees around now I'm lucky if I see a couple a day. This is not normal. Elon is gonna bombard the whole earth with 5g at some point, there will be no escape for insects. There are very important pollinators that do not have hard shells, moth for example.

This is extinction level stuff. I suggest you read some of the links I have added, pretty much all of them are credible sources. One is even of a scientists that is also a beekeeper.
We really shouldn’t worry about extinction from 5G and certainly not satellite radiation - at least not until we find a way to launch one of our nuclear power plants into orbit. Power kills not wavelength. Besides, there are billions of people in underdeveloped countries without 5G that will gladly step over our bodies to repopulate the planet.

Instead, let’s worry about the growing, real evidence that we have already passed the tipping point for creating an irreversible climate extinction event. Scientists model events based on knowledge from the past and even that knowledge is limited. The amount of methane and carbon captured in land and submarine permafrost would probably be enough to put us over the top. Since we haven't studied these sources much, we can only say there are hundreds of billion tons of greenhouse gasses captured. Humans are an experiment, not a necessity for the actual survival of this planet. Mother Nature could defrost her freezer at any time and between bees and humans, I’d give the bees a better chance of survival.
 

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Will give my thoughts here and these aren't particular to original question of harm relative to bees.
In any description of RF (radio frequency) transmission several factors have to be mentioned;

1- frequency of the source.
2- ERP= Effective Radiated Power or how much power is really being radiated from the antenna.
3- Direction of radio emission; isotropic, directional (isotropic radiation would be similar to the the Sun as it radiates in all directions. Consider this to similar to a single vertical antenna (sorry for the poor analogy)
Directional radiation- radio waves aimed in a specific direction using various style antennas (though not the same they are like old roof mounted TV antennas)

Here's some background history to help. The USSR beamed microwaves at the US embassy in Moscow the effect of which produced headaches and discomfort in embassy staff. There was a similar program in Cuba the consequence of which has been named "Havana syndrome". It's basically "cooking people" with radio waves. (It didn't kill anyone so far as I know).

Also, and this doesn't matter too much- I've been working with radio transmitters of various sorts for the past 40 years. Lastly, I'm 20 miles from home so as Mark Twain (I think) said I qualify as an expert.

5G operates on a frequency 28 and 39 gHz (gigaHertz). The frequency of a microwave oven magnetron, which cooks using radio waves, is 2.45 gHz.

5G, because of its frequency will penetrate the skin to the depth of about 1/32" (depending on which "current expert" on the web you're reading)

So can 5G kills bees and anything else that breathes? Yes, of course and very simply too. However, it all depends upon the level of all 3 numbered items above. 'Give you an example;

1000 watts of 5G radiated from a directional tower with a narrow beam antenna at a distance of around 100 feet will indeed "warm you up". It'll simply heat your skin and you will feel it. However, again, because of the "inverse square law" if you double the distance to 200 feet the effect of the 5G radiation becomes only about 1/4 of the original location's. Simply put- you wont feel it much...sort of...but your skin is still being effected.

Now, considering the above example is exaggerated in terms of ERP (1kW) and a Directional antenna. If I remember correctly the FCC limits cell towers to a maximum of 100 watts in rural areas which translate into about 5-10 watts ERP. So at a distance of about 1 mile there would be no noticeable effect upon you. Even at a distance of around 100 feet you'd feel nothing. I said "feel" but there would be an effect as the radio waves would still be hitting you.

There is much to be said about the effects of rf (radio frequency) upon us creatures but the amount of power that hits you, me, the bees or anything else is a variable not easily answered.

Power levels of 5g can be kept low BUT that requires more transmission stations. That's why, in the US, there's an effort of have a multitude of base stations...everywhere- your house....your neighbours house....all of the houses in your neighbourhood...on top of telephone poles and anywhere that's feasible for the purpose. Keep the power levels low while using a multitude of transmission stations.

Now, here's the most important factor- you know that phone everyone supposedly owns and carries around with them that's on 24 hours a day until the battery's dead? Putting that up next to your head or anywhere on your body will have more exposure to 5G RF than the tower that's 200 feet away.

So, can 5G kill bees? Yes, it can but it all depends on the transmitter's power output and proximity to the bees. As to the famous video of the dead bees in California near the cell tower- I'd be inclined to believe when the tower was serviced the technicians got stung by the bees nesting on one of the antennas and took the practical solution of spraying them....dead.

I've often wondered why the powers that be haven't used lasers or simply infrared light instead of radio waves?

However, beyond the technical aspect this there's a philosophical and moral element to it. What's the need for this 5G stuff? Faster data rates? Or can it best be used to track everyone and everything?

Be seeing you....

Peter
 

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Interesting. Thank you for posting Peter.

My cell carrier is discontinuing the 3G my present phone operates on, and providing a free phone, not sure if it will be 4G or 5G. I usually carry my phone in a pocket or pouch, on my person, and I'm starting to be concerned about the safety of that.

Alice



Will give my thoughts here and these aren't particular to original question of harm relative to bees.
In any description of RF (radio frequency) transmission several factors have to be mentioned;

1- frequency of the source.
2- ERP= Effective Radiated Power or how much power is really being radiated from the antenna.
3- Direction of radio emission; isotropic, directional (isotropic radiation would be similar to the the Sun as it radiates in all directions. Consider this to similar to a single vertical antenna (sorry for the poor analogy)
Directional radiation- radio waves aimed in a specific direction using various style antennas (though not the same they are like old roof mounted TV antennas)

Here's some background history to help. The USSR beamed microwaves at the US embassy in Moscow the effect of which produced headaches and discomfort in embassy staff. There was a similar program in Cuba the consequence of which has been named "Havana syndrome". It's basically "cooking people" with radio waves. (It didn't kill anyone so far as I know).

Also, and this doesn't matter too much- I've been working with radio transmitters of various sorts for the past 40 years. Lastly, I'm 20 miles from home so as Mark Twain (I think) said I qualify as an expert.

5G operates on a frequency 28 and 39 gHz (gigaHertz). The frequency of a microwave oven magnetron, which cooks using radio waves, is 2.45 gHz.

5G, because of its frequency will penetrate the skin to the depth of about 1/32" (depending on which "current expert" on the web you're reading)

So can 5G kills bees and anything else that breathes? Yes, of course and very simply too. However, it all depends upon the level of all 3 numbered items above. 'Give you an example;

1000 watts of 5G radiated from a directional tower with a narrow beam antenna at a distance of around 100 feet will indeed "warm you up". It'll simply heat your skin and you will feel it. However, again, because of the "inverse square law" if you double the distance to 200 feet the effect of the 5G radiation becomes only about 1/4 of the original location's. Simply put- you wont feel it much...sort of...but your skin is still being effected.

Now, considering the above example is exaggerated in terms of ERP (1kW) and a Directional antenna. If I remember correctly the FCC limits cell towers to a maximum of 100 watts in rural areas which translate into about 5-10 watts ERP. So at a distance of about 1 mile there would be no noticeable effect upon you. Even at a distance of around 100 feet you'd feel nothing. I said "feel" but there would be an effect as the radio waves would still be hitting you.

There is much to be said about the effects of rf (radio frequency) upon us creatures but the amount of power that hits you, me, the bees or anything else is a variable not easily answered.

Power levels of 5g can be kept low BUT that requires more transmission stations. That's why, in the US, there's an effort of have a multitude of base stations...everywhere- your house....your neighbours house....all of the houses in your neighbourhood...on top of telephone poles and anywhere that's feasible for the purpose. Keep the power levels low while using a multitude of transmission stations.

Now, here's the most important factor- you know that phone everyone supposedly owns and carries around with them that's on 24 hours a day until the battery's dead? Putting that up next to your head or anywhere on your body will have more exposure to 5G RF than the tower that's 200 feet away.

So, can 5G kill bees? Yes, it can but it all depends on the transmitter's power output and proximity to the bees. As to the famous video of the dead bees in California near the cell tower- I'd be inclined to believe when the tower was serviced the technicians got stung by the bees nesting on one of the antennas and took the practical solution of spraying them....dead.

I've often wondered why the powers that be haven't used lasers or simply infrared light instead of radio waves?

However, beyond the technical aspect this there's a philosophical and moral element to it. What's the need for this 5G stuff? Faster data rates? Or can it best be used to track everyone and everything?

Be seeing you....

Peter
 
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