gulf oil spill what if

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by riverrat, Jun 9, 2010.

  1. riverrat

    riverrat New Member

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    I have been watching the gulf oil spill on the news. It got me to thinking if they are having this much trouble in a warm climate capping a well under water. what would happen if this was to happen on the north slope in alaska an area that is far more remote and in a drastically different climate
     
  2. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    The government would keep it hushed and not let it be known. Like Roswell, NM.
     

  3. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    I think perhaps riverrat a goodly part of the problem is that 5000 feet below sea level is a drastically different climate.

    unfortunate for the oil companies (I think you can make similar comparison for any concern that extracts raw natural resources) at least one more dirty little lie is now out in regards to the oil exploration folks. since most of us regular folks minds don't work in that manner of exploiters it will be curious to see how many folks begin to add 1+1 and realize that it equals 2.

    as to what if: if the spill had of occurred 2 years ago is there any doubt in your mind that petro at the pump would have already jumped 25 cents? yet in this space and time it has decline by a quarter?
     
  4. sqkcrk

    sqkcrk New Member

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    I don't know about that last statement. How much can production from one well effect the pump price? It's like a honey crop shortage in one country effecting the shelf price in the U.S. I don't see that the impact would occur. How do you? I'm probably missing something in your statement. It is early.

    I don't see the cause and effect.
     
  5. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    humm...

    I don't know either Mark. yet two years ago the treat of one hurricane shutting down a few refineries along the gulf certainly caused petro at the pump to spike about $.40/gallon here. so why did the current incident result in petro at the pump price to fall? did it in some way (and in a classical economic sense) cause supplies to increase or demand to fall? perhaps the inherent level of GREED of those making decisions in the industry is the underlying cause of $ change and supply and demand is a vague allusion?
     
  6. sqkcrk

    sqkcrk New Member

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    Modern day supply and demand economics is probably an illusion. The "market" is too complex (as if I really know what I am writing about. ha!!), but I think it is. Just look at the milk industry. What it costs to produce a gallon of milk and what that gallon of milk sells for in the grocery store SEEM to have nothing to do w/ each other. And, around here anyway, dairy farmers are paid less than the cost of production and even though there are farms that go out of business there are still farms that don't and we have plenty of milk.

    I don't really know, but I don't think that the hurricane threat or the oil spill had anything to do w/ pump prices. For one thing, the market reaction time was too short. Now, if the price went up 6 months or a year after a specific occurance, then maybe we could point to a cause and effect example.

    Bottom line. I really don't know, but I'm skeptical about pointing at hurricane threats as causes of price increases and oil spills as cause of drop. Just me.
     
  7. riverrat

    riverrat New Member

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    My 17 year old son brought up a good point yesterday. Since BP is a british company he though it was only fair that the relocate all the fisherman and other people who are effected by the spill and let them make a living in there waters until it is cleaned up and back to where they can make a viable living. Put the british people out of a job that way there would be 2 governments on bp back to get it cleaned up. I bet if that was the case they would have had it capped by now
     
  8. Bens-Bees

    Bens-Bees New Member

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    I thought BP was a canadian company...
    I know that BP stands for Beyond Petroleum and not British Petroleum like many people think it does though.
     
  9. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    No, BP did stand for British Petroleum, but is now only BP, PLC. And the UK is not happy with O'bummer not knowing it.

    >>>>The UK is freaking out right now about the U.S. reaction to the BP Deepwater Horizon oil spill.

    Major Conservative political leader and Mayor of London Boris Johnson has called President Barack Obama's language "anti-British" after the President called BP 'British Petroleum' rather than its modern name.

    Conservative Lord Tebbit's quote is just too vitriolic to paraphrase.

    From The Daily Mail:

    "The whole might of American wealth and technology is displayed as utterly unable to deal with the disastrous spill - so what more natural than a crude, bigoted, xenophobic display of partisan political Presidential petulance against a multinational company," said Lord Tebbit.<<<<

    http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/ar ... tion-To-BP
     
  10. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    sqkcrk writes:
    Modern day supply and demand economics is probably an illusion.

    tecumseh:
    when there is little relationship in regards to the price at the production end of the chain and the consumption end of the chain then one would reasonable assume that any connection between the two ends may be quite loose or as you suggest perhaps more an illusion than anything else. Of course economic writing are full of examples where supply and demand on occasion doesn't do anything like what the general public thinks it is suppose to do... some of these are quite classical in nature.

    I guess the brit ain't so happy with the loss of all that money. when the american population finds out that BP (initials generally do stand for something... correct?) has a cap on their liability (pushed for and signed by the Bush administration) they will not be so happy with BP either when the realization set in as to who will be paying the tab. I suspect the collapse of image will be so great as to cause BP to totally withdraw from the US market. At that point the US market for petroleum products will be even more monopolist than it is now and the american public can expect to be price gouged once again at the first opportunity.
     
  11. sqkcrk

    sqkcrk New Member

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    And when folks go to the courts for some justice and they find out that BP is British and doesn't have to do what U.S. courts tell it to they will be quite angry and protectionist. Rightly so.

    U.S. courts have little if any sway over BP.
     
  12. alleyyooper

    alleyyooper New Member

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    The public can put pressure on BP if they want. We have 3 BP stations in town, they could go totally with out customers. To bad that in a state with 15.5% unemployement the workers who lost their job as a result wouldn't be good.

    :mrgreen: Al
     
  13. riverrat

    riverrat New Member

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    I have never filled a vehicle or bought gas at a bp station. We dont have many in my part of the woods. But even if i did have them i wouldnt do busness with them I like to try to keep my money in the united states and buy american when i can. The oil spill is just one more reason to not trade with bp
     
  14. Mama Beek

    Mama Beek New Member

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    actually BP supplies gas and multitudes of other products in both finished and raw form to almost all other gas stations. Our old hometown had an AMOCO station, it sold BP gas because no one else would deliver it for as good a price. It's difficult to say boycott a company when you aren't really hurting the company by not buying fuel at BP branded gas stations.

    Don't take me wrong, I believe that the company should be responsible, and that whatever action folks take to ensure that is fine with me.... just that what most folks consider as an action that would encourage BP to do the right thing would in this particular case only complicate an already difficult situation.
     
  15. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    I have bought BP for years. There was an article a few years ago that listed the different companies and how much oil they imported into the USA. BP was 0... They did not import into the USA. Only domestic oil was bought. So they had an accident. So what? It couldn't happen to a company that only drilled in Saudi Arabia, now could it. So are you going to support only the ones that import, and boycott the ones that sell our domestic oil.

    It seems to me that BP is doing a lot to contain it and would do more if Washington, DC would quit getting in the way. They have containment boats sitting idle because they are not registered in the USA, so the feds won't let them help. Many other similar stories out there.
     
  16. riverrat

    riverrat New Member

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    I got to agree with mama beek and Iddee I never looked at it at from this angle. I have heard about the containment boats not being used but hadnt heard of why. I guess when we live in a global economy Its hard to live within our boundries. I have never seen the report on who imports oil thanks iddee for sharing this.
     
  17. Bens-Bees

    Bens-Bees New Member

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    I was wrong, they aren't Canadian but are indeed headquartered in the UK...

    I have to agree with Iddee that boycotting BP isn't the right solution here... but cutting down on the amount of oil we consume as a whole would help reduce the frequency of oil spills. But cutting down on total oil consumed is a lot harder than it sounds. Simply driving less here won't do it because that would simply cause a small drop in price that would cause more people to drive elsewhere which would re-raise the total consumption back up to what it was originally.
     
  18. sqkcrk

    sqkcrk New Member

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    We are addicted to oil. Almost everything we do , make or cinsume is dependent on oil. It's either made out of oil or oil is used to produce it, package it or transport it. So what are we to do?

    We can't live w/out it. So we'd better get the some control on how it is extracted from the earth. We can't afford to waste it like what we are seeing in the gulf.

    I heard an experienced oil reclamations person who has worked oil spills in Alaska (Valdeez) and other places. He says that only 10% of what was spilled gets reclaimed. Ten percent. Other than making the environment "look" nice (nice enuf for us to fool ourselves into thinking that things are back to normal and okay) is the expense of reclaiming 10% worth the cost?

    And spils happen every day all over the world polluting our oceans and making the harvesting of food from them no longer possible.

    Oil spills and over fishing will make eating from the oceans more difficult.

    And on that bright note I am going to go bottle some more honey.
     
  19. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    sqkcrk writes:
    And spils happen every day all over the world polluting our oceans and making the harvesting of food from them no longer possible.

    tecusmeh:
    if it doesn't happen in our back yard and we don't have to live with the mess 'we' never seem to care. If our addiction to oil ruins the lives of entire villages in some remote third world country we don't even notice the news report.

    ah I see we are back to the 'get the government out of the way' nonsense. perhaps next (like somewhat recently in the editiorial page) we will get some right wing intellectual (or at least someone posed as one... sounds oxymoric to me) that it is the environmentalist fault that this spilled occurred anyway.

    PS... one of my friends here had the pleasure of testifying before the senate panel in regards to the spill. he (being a good canadian lad... who did keep bees long ago + was the drummer in the band 3 Dog Nights when he and I were young men) had the nerve to actually pose a difficult (not fluff ball) question to the senators. The question was... given all the tax credits and write offs use by the various oil companys to respond to this kind of accident, where is all the stuff?
     
  20. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    right wing intellectual isn't an oxymoron, it's just redundant. :thumbsup: :wave: :D :D :D