Laying Workers

Discussion in 'Raising Queens' started by Casey Johnson, Jul 16, 2018.

  1. Casey Johnson

    Casey Johnson Member

    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    8
    I recently had a hive swarm. I was unable to catch it which is disappointing. The good news was there were 8+ capped queen cells in the hive.

    Fast forward to today, I guess the hatched queen never made it back because it has been a while since the queen cells hatched and now I have multiple eggs per cell. Here is the timeline:
    June 24th at 12 PM - Swarm
    June 25th - found 8+ capped queen cells. A more experience bee keeper helped me in this inspection. He found some bur comb and said there was something in it. He opened it up and found what appeared to be a very young queen bee. She quickly ran into the hive and we couldn't find her after that.
    June 26th - most likely the day they hatched
    June 27th - Tried splitting but all cells were open
    July 8th - No larvae or eggs present
    July 10th - I ordered a new hybrid Russian queen to be shipped on July 17th
    July 14th - Multiple eggs were found in cells. Usually they were 2-4 eggs per cell.
    July 16th - I am researching the best way to introduce a new mated queen to the hive.

    I don't have any apiaries around so I assume the new queen failed to mate. What is the best way to introduce a new queen? I am getting mixed reviews online.
     
  2. Casey Johnson

    Casey Johnson Member

    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Well, been pondering this all day and I think I know what I am going to do. To give you a better understanding of what I have, I will try to explain. I have two hives, Hive 1 is in Location A. Hive 2 is in Location B. The locations are roughly 30 miles apart.

    Hive 1 was strong until the swarm. Now Hive 1 doesn't have a queen and the working nurse bees are laying duds. Current setup is two deeps and one medium.

    Hive 2 is weak but has the original queen. Not getting into why t hey are weak here as there is another thread on that. They are weak but have the original queen. Current setup is one deep.

    Thursday this week, a new mated queen will show up in the mail. I know I can't put her directly into a laying worker bee hive as they will ball her up. I have read that the only way to fix a laying worker hive is to distribute them to other hives.

    Here is my plan.
    I am going to move the top deep in Hive 1 and put it where Hive 2 is at currently. No eggs are in the top deep in Hive 1. I will then introduce the caged queen and let them eat through the candy. This will reside at Location B.

    Then I will take Hive 2 and put it on the bottom of Hive 1 at Location A. I might put a screen in between the two so that the sense of fertilized brood cures the laying workers. The top will have the small entrance at the top which will allow them to come and go. I will leave the screen on for a week which should be enough time for the sense to work its way up to the top deep.

    I will feed both hives during this process. Kinda confusing but I think this will get the job done. I welcome any thoughts...
     

  3. Gypsi

    Gypsi Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    3,453
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I think that will work, but instead of the screen you might use newspaper as long as Hive 1 is strong enough and has larger numbers than Hive 2.
     
  4. Casey Johnson

    Casey Johnson Member

    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    8
    This is turning into a circus. Tore apart hive 1 and I spected the top deep. It had larvae and eggs. The eggs were single and the roar was gone. I assume there is a queen now. So rather than put the newly mated Russian queen in a hive that might have a good queen, I took her up to hive 2 and replaced the queen there. I've been thinking g the queen in hive 2 has been the issue with that hive all along. We shall see. I will say, I hate pinching queens :(
     
  5. Meathelmet

    Meathelmet New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Snelgrove describes a method in “The Introduction Of Queen Bees” that worked well for me in the same situation. Short version is place frames of UNCAPPED brood from your queen right hive into the laying worker hive to repress the laying workers. Three days later introduce your corked queen cage. Three days later remove the cork and let bees release her. Laying workers will have been repressed by presence of open brood pheromones and they will have had time to accept her before she is at risk of being rejected and balled. Worked for me.
     
    Gypsi likes this.
  6. Casey Johnson

    Casey Johnson Member

    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Good info Meathelmet. Thanks for sharing. I am still monitoring and will be for the next month or so. I should have a very good idea what is going on in a month. I am heading up to Hive 2 to check on the caged queen to see if she has been released yet or not. It has rained for the past two days here so I assume with the extra time in the hive, they should have let her out. Fingers crossed.
     
    Meathelmet likes this.
  7. Gypsi

    Gypsi Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    3,453
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Hope it goes well
     
  8. Casey Johnson

    Casey Johnson Member

    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Once again I made the wrong decision. I second guessed myself and thought there was indeed a queen in the hive based on eggs being centered and mostly single eggs per cell. We'll...there is no queen. The capped cells are all drones.
    I'm going to start slowly merging the two hives in attempt to keep one alive this year. Lots if failures this year. Hopefully I learned enough to be successful next year.
     
  9. Gypsi

    Gypsi Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    3,453
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    48
    well Casey, I shook em out and they flew back and killed the queen I bought them the next day. so I guess I recommend a newspaper combine and put your queen right hive on top, and make a hole or 2 in the paper. It is no fun when they do this. Alternatively, steal their honey, most of them are 3 weeks old or older? They will eventually die off or merge with your other hive on their own. They won't be made viable except by a combine.
     
  10. Casey Johnson

    Casey Johnson Member

    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    8
    The queen right hive has had the new queen for 10 days now. I am going to check it tomorrow before I move one or two frames over from the queenless hive. I was going to use a sheet of that #8 hardware cloth so the bees would be able to see each other but not really touch. Leave that there for a week and then the open brood should convert the laying worker hive... That's my thought anyway.