Newbees and excluders

Discussion in 'Beekeeping 101' started by markles, Apr 5, 2012.

  1. markles

    markles New Member

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    Hello all. Just wanted to share a “how not to do it†experience in the hope that it might help other newbees (like me).
    I recently completed a trapout on a borehole pipe. The trapout itself went very well and I ended up with a nice active colony with a good queen who started laying some 50 days ago. 32 days ago I moved them to my apiary on our farm after putting a super on them. They settled down nicely and 6 days after moving them (26 days ago) an inspection showed that they had just started building comb in the super – so I put a queen excluder on.
    This afternoon I took the cover off to see how far they had got in the super and the first bee I saw (on the underside of the lid) was the queen. I was so careful when I put the excluder on – stupid mistake :shock:. Anyway, I’m fairly sure I managed to get her into the brood box, removed the excluder and put them to bed. The super has been “stripped†of the little bit of comb that was in there.
    What I saw in the brood box was interesting and a real learning experience. About 30% of the comb was completely empty and polished, 40% of the comb was full of capped honey, 25% uncapped honey and about 5% pollen. There was not one egg or any brood, capped or uncapped. I guess it was the presence of the queen in the upper super that stopped workers from laying.
    I’ll check again for eggs and brood in about ten days as I imagine SHE will take a couple of days to start laying again, or so I’m hoping.
    Moral of the story - queen excluders are dangerous in the hands of newbees and should be treated with respect
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2012
  2. riverbee

    riverbee Active Member

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    "There was not one egg or any brood, capped or uncapped. I guess it was the presence of the queen in the upper super that stopped workers from laying."

    i am sure that this is not what you meant, "stopped workers from laying."

    queens in the spring will sometimes be found on the underside of the inner cover, this is where the heat is. just my guess, when you placed the excluder on she was either on the underside of your inner cover or in the super you had on. when you placed the excluder on without examing the super or inner cover for her, she was trapped above. queens will wander in supers but prefer to lay in the darker combs below.

    if you are using foundation in a super for the bees to draw out comb on, they are sometimes reluctant to do so through an excluder. if i have frames of foundation in a super to be drawn, i leave the excluder off until the foundation is drawn, and also, i use them as i am now to relieve congestion and keep the bees busy.
     

  3. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    Rat, he is saying the queen in the super prevented the hive from becoming a laying worker hive, so yes, he meant "stopped the workers from laying".
     
  4. PerryBee

    PerryBee New Member

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    "stopped workers from laying"
    I think what Markles was referring to was that in the absence of a queen, there is a high likelyhood of developing laying workers. Because the queen and her pheremone were present (albeit in an unfortunate place) the pheremones she gave off supressed the ability of worker bees to become "laying workers", thus the lack of any eggs, larvae or brood.
     
  5. PerryBee

    PerryBee New Member

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    Riverbee, Iddee, not Riverrat! :lol: :rolling::rotfl:
     
  6. riverbee

    riverbee Active Member

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    yes okay guys, i misread what he said, i thought he said he had laying workers and they stopped laying, and i was like huh?

    yeah iddee...RIVERBEE!

    must be tired this morning. :grin:
     
  7. PerryBee

    PerryBee New Member

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    Geez, I don't know riverbee, you are taking this being called a "Rat" by Iddee awfully well. I don't know if I would bee that easy going myself, in fact, I'd bee tempted to call him a few names right back! :lol::box:
     
  8. riverbee

    riverbee Active Member

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    well perry,
    i best pick and choose my battles this morning with the brain fart i just had,:doh: but i think i shall save it for a rainy day!:lol:
     
  9. markles

    markles New Member

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    Thanks for the input everyone. Yes, I was refering to the pheremones preventing any workers taking over the queen role and laying eggs. Thinking about the hives predicament I've decided that tomorrow I'll "ask" one of my other hives to donate a frame of brood and eggs so at least there are some emerging bees to do nurse duties etc. Anyone have any thoughts on a time frame for the queen to re-start laying? She had to stop while she was trapped in the super as there was nowhere to lay.
     
  10. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    Yeah, kinda hard to give a guy a hard time for misreading a misread post, ain't it, RIVERBEE?


    Markle, she should be laying within 24 to 48 hours.
     
  11. riverbee

    riverbee Active Member

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    IDDEEEE….
    seeing’s how both of us had brain farts with names and bees, i will give you that……and i will even let you skate by on calling me a ‘dang yankee’…….:bow:

    :lol:

    btw markles, the queen should start laying pronto
    iddee his name his MARKLES, not markle...
    tee-hee!!!
     
  12. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    But I thought he was only one. I didn't know he was plural. :razz:
     
  13. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    so what kind of bees might these be?

    a queen anywhere in the box would prevent a laying worker no matter which side of the excluder she might be on. as to above question.... if scutella I would wonder if there is an excluder specifically made to exclude one of those? if these are european bees I would pretty much figure 'the mistake' like riverbee suggested (quite obviously she has not been in the lower box for some time).

    so was there any 'progress' on the upper super upon your last inspection?
     
  14. barry42001

    barry42001 New Member

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  15. PerryBee

    PerryBee New Member

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    Iddee's havin a tough day keepin the crowd under control. :lol:
     
  16. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    give my brother iddee a break... at our age we have come to recognize that we control nothing.
     
  17. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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  18. barry42001

    barry42001 New Member

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    don't have much power lol but om good days I can type lol
    Barry
     
  19. barry42001

    barry42001 New Member

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    Tec,
    are you suggesting that lack of control would perhaps mean a need for depends?
     
  20. markles

    markles New Member

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    I see there's a lil bit of spring fever on the forum today - enjoy. I'm jealous as were just going into winter. Actually, my name is Mark. My wifes name is Les so our e-mail address is markles (we tend to use it for a lot of things - easy to remember). So Iddee was right as always - markles is plural. Yay! I'm a plural.:lol:
    Have fun guys, I'll keep you updated.

    Mark