Picking the right queen cell

Discussion in 'General Beekeeping' started by brooksbeefarm, Feb 2, 2011.

  1. brooksbeefarm

    brooksbeefarm New Member

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    It won't be to long before swarm season,and i was wondering how some of you pick queen cells to start nuc's with, when you find several in a hive :confused: .(i know not all of you do that) I usually pick two of the biggest best formed ones,and try to put two per nuc.Some older beeks in our club say to pick the ones in the upper part of the frames,not the ones hanging near the bottom of the frame :confused: .I don't recall seeing a post on this, and thought i'd ask some of you queen producers.I don't see a difference unless it's a dink. Jack
     
  2. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    I'm not a queen producer, but I choose any of the larger ones, by their ease of removing. If they are on a crosswire, or otherwise hard to cut out, I either leave them or take the whole frame.
     

  3. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    I raise my own cells so the question here is generally more about which cells do you cull.

    I could reasonable believe that cells at the center top of the brood nest might be better cells for a couple of reasons.
     
  4. brooksbeefarm

    brooksbeefarm New Member

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    Sorry, didn't mean just queen producers,i'd like anyone's opinion :thumbsup: .Jack
     
  5. PerryBee

    PerryBee New Member

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    Maybe I'm wrong on this but here's my two cents.
    I would think the diet fed to swarm cells would be better than the diet fed to a cell partway up on a frame. Are not the cells raised on the sides of frames considered emergency queen cells and therefore the age of the egg/larvae might not be just right for producing a quality queen, where as the swarm cells were raised from the get go as potential queens and would have been fed the appropriate diet from the beginning? :dontknow:
    That brings to mind another question, what is the difference between an emergency queen cell and a supercedure cell, location would be the same wouldn't it? :confused:
    Emergency implies something catastrophic occured and supercedure could simply be replacing an ageing queen.
     
  6. fatbeeman

    fatbeeman New Member

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    here's my 2 cents a larva or egg is no better where its place on frame. look to see if well formed and capped. in good conditions you can harvest 10=20 cells per frame.
    I don't like to place 2 cell to a nuc because they might hatch same time and kill each other. do 1 if it don't take add another.
    Don
     
  7. brooksbeefarm

    brooksbeefarm New Member

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    One oldtimer told me that the queen cell in the upper part of the frame may not look as big as those hanging on the bottom of the frame, but are because there body is in the comb and the cell doesn't have to stick up far, which make some beeks think there dink's. He thinks that they are in a warmer place and they develope better in the upper part of the frame. :confused: One club member(from NY) won't tell anybody his secret spot on the frame were he will only keep a queen from.He also works bees without a veil and kisses the bees on the frame for our new club beekeepers.He spent three days in the hospital last summer,he got ahold of the wrong hive. :shock: Jack
     
  8. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    Perry writes:
    That brings to mind another question, what is the difference between an emergency queen cell and a supercedure cell, location would be the same wouldn't it?

    tecumseh:
    I think according to the book a hive of bees will produce a queen for three different reasons. The above two purpose for a hive constructing cells would suggest that a hive constructs queen cells from an egg laid to be a worker (in a worker cell) from what ever genetic material happens to be of the correct age. It might appear anywhere on the frame. Some location of cell production are easier to cover (and feed) during cold weather snaps than other locations.
     
  9. brooksbeefarm

    brooksbeefarm New Member

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    Ok tec, you got my curiosity up. What two reasons you think cells in the upper part of the brood nest could be better. :confused: Jack
     
  10. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    hate to repeat myself... well perhaps hate ain't the proper word here.
    >to jack a tecumseh snip..
    Some location of cell production are easier to cover (and feed) during cold weather snaps than other locations.

    at least when you are creating queen cells in number on a cell bar the hive does trim (cull) cells at the outer most ends of the bar. feeding or stuff coming in the front door also has a large effect of the number of cells trimmed (ie culled by the bees themselves).

    hope that helps Jack.
     
  11. brooksbeefarm

    brooksbeefarm New Member

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    Sorry about that tec. and thanks. Somehow i didn't see your post #8 :confused: . Jack
     
  12. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    We all miss detail from time to time Jack and it really is no bother to go back and list 1 thru X later for folks.

    ps.. if I had more control over the cells I produced and they were not somewhat exposed to the elements in an out building I would likely never notice how temperatures dips leads to culling of cells at the ends of the cell bar. other observations I have noticed in regards to cells is that high temperature leads to the new queen emerging early (ie capped time is can be greatly shortened) and low temperature often means the newly emerged queen look physically shaky or weak.

    as a final note Jack one of the authorities at the North American Conference suggest that in regards to grading new laying queens length is less important than the width of the abdomen of queen. it was suggested than any (tecumseh just randomly stops typing and then begins again 24 hours later) queen with a thin abdomen be pinched.
     
  13. brooksbeefarm

    brooksbeefarm New Member

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    A few years ago i had a hive supersede with a queen i would call a dink.She looked all head and upper body with a small abdoman,my plan was to requeen her when another queen became avaible.Well i got busy with other things and when i got back to it,(about 1 1/2 months later)that hive was a boomer. I went back in the hive looking for the queen and found her,she didn't have a long abdoman like most queens but it was wider (looked something like a small drone) I'm pretty sure it was the same dink queen i had seen earlier.She turned out to be one of the better queens i've had.She was a runner(hard to find) and the workers would cover her to hide her from the intruder. :mrgreen: Glad i didn't kill her. So i'm not sure the cell size has alot to do with picking a good queen, there are many more variables at play here,genetics,weather,available drones,ect. :confused: Jack