Small Hive Beetles ?

Discussion in 'Pests and Diseases' started by tcchris, May 16, 2010.

  1. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    Hi , this is my first year of beekeeping . We started late , hived the bees 1 week ago , released queen 3 days later . They had eaten through most of the candy by then .
    I seem to have shb's . Little beetles running around at the top hive feeder .
    I saw one when we opened the top on day two to check sugar water , and today I see about 6 or 8 up there .
    Is this normal to get them that fast or did they come with the bees ?
    I made a temporary trap out of a ddr ram case , one hole on each side . Canola oil in bottom and a little cap of banana vinegar mix in the middle . I put this trap above the inner cover which is above the feeder .
    I am not apposed to buying a trap , I just felt I should do something immediately .
    Any suggestions on traps or bait appreciated .

    By the way , I have a screened bottom board , one brood chamber so far , and the feeder inner cover and outer cover .Also my inner cover has no notch in front , does that matter in georgia ?
     
  2. rast

    rast New Member

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    If they are SHB, you're right, the faster the better.
    Was this a package? Sounds like it.
    New equipment or used?
    Drawn comb or foundation?
    I would keep the bees as compacted as possible as they draw out frames with a division board, assuming they are on foundation. If they are on drawn comb, pull out some frames and add it as they fill it. The point is you want so many bees in their living quarters that the SHB is too busy running from a bee to stop and lay eggs.
    If you have screened bottom board with a slide provision, I would get a slide in oil pan.
    I'm still wondering if they are SHB's in a hive this new.
     

  3. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    It was a 3lb package
    I have 1 10 frame brood chamber with 10 frames with wax foundation .
    I built the box and frames new from kits I purchased the week before .
    I am not sure what a division board is , I can google it .
    I will check on the oil pan , but that has to be temporary , right ? Don't I need the screen for ventilation ? or no ?
    I can not say that they are shb or not , as I am new . I was also surprised . I may go get a photo If one shows up on top , maybe someone can say for sure .
     
  4. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    Here is a photo of a beetle crawling down the side , and my trap contraption

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  5. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    You're doing fine. Continue to fight them any way you can, until the bees are strong enough to keep them at bay. With foundation, it will be easier to take care of the beetles than if you were using drawn, so you should be all right. If your hive is getting shade, it might help to move them to sun. SHB love shade, hate sun.

    The screen bottom is a 50/50 deal. It may help, it may not. Beekeepers kept hives for 150 years in GA. without them.
     
  6. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    Thanks Guys , I think I will get a slide in oil pan , should be ok till it gets really hot anyway , right ?
    We dont have wild honeybees here , I have never seen more than two at a time , so I don't see how the bugs found me so fast . Is it common to get them from a package , or should I find another source ?
    I appreciate the help , I am new so I have a million questions , I guess some are best answered by experience though .
     
  7. G3farms

    G3farms New Member

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    I can assure you there are feral and kept bees in your area!

    Ask all of the questions you can think of, others may also benefit from them.

    SBB are susposed to let the beetles and mites fall through to the ground, sticky board or oil pan. I stuck a couple of beetle blasters in my hives (a small oil pan that fits in between two frames) and have have some success with them, no chemicals is what Ilike best about them.

    You can and will get SHB and mites in a package, sorry :|

    Welcome to the forum also!! :hi:

    G3
     
  8. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    News from the front .
    I have been opening the top cover and inner cover about 3 times a day , looking for beetles .
    I figure this is unobtrusive since I have the top feeder still in place .
    After doing this and squashing every beetle I see , today I did not see any beetles .
    Score so far : thumb > 8 , beetletrap > 0 .
    Next Saturday we will inspect for eggs , it will be 10 days since queen released .
    Will be on the lookout for beetles then too .
     
  9. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    Hi
    since the beginning we have lost our original queen , the replacement is doing fine .
    Today we inspected , and two frames were being gouged by SHB larvae .
    I cut out the bad parts and burned them , then put the frames back .
    Will that take care of it , or is this about to get a lot worse ?
    I have a screened bottom board , and I bought some beetle traps , but I have not caught any beetles .
    Also I don't see a lot of beetles in the hive either .
    Advice appreciated .
     
  10. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    snip:
    'and two frames were being gouged by SHB larvae'
    tecumseh:
    first I am confused.... you seem to suggest above you have larvae but then later no adults?

    first and most important point... cutting out bits or pieces of comb will not eliminate the eggs in the infected frames.

    the first thing I do upon seeing larvae in frames is to freeze that frame (wrap in a plastic garbage bag if you are sharing the freezer with a spouse) for 24 hours then set the frame back into hive. secondly if you have another hive boost with 'a' frame of soon to emerge bees (brush off the adults). if your honey flow is on the wane feed a bit.
     
  11. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    Tecumseh , I only meant that I did not see the adults , not that they are not there .
    I will remove and freeze those frames tomorrow .
    I do have another hive now but it is new and weak also , although it is doing better than this one .
    Thanks Tecumseh
    I read in a book , that I would not have to worry with pests the first year .
    By the way , if anyone else is new , the indication we got that something was wrong was the bees dragging larvae out of the hive .
     
  12. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    Your are of course welcome and generally correct that most time severe shb infestation can be noticed at the front door.

    if the hive is robust (with worker population) larvae, some times bit of pollen and wax debris will come at the front door approximately at the point of infestation.

    I would be curious as to what book would even suggest that a new hive would have no pest problem in year 1???

    If you are not feeding you might wish to think about doing so (I am unfamilar with your area's current condition so I am speculating that your flow is decreasing quickly) and you might want to do this to both hives. About the cheapest and best feeder I have used in recent times is a zip lock freezer baggie.

    good luck...
     
  13. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    I have read that varroa is normally no problem the first year, but I have never read that about other pests. Why would a skunk or bear care how old a hive was? Wax moths can devastate a weak hive in a couple of weeks, first year or not. So can SHB.
     
  14. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    I could be wrong about what I read .
    I read several books and a few forums , so it all bleeds together after a while . Maybe it was just the varroa .
    We are going out in a little bit to pull the frames and freeze them .
    The hive seems much less active than my new one .
    The first one (the problem hive ) was a package , then a replacement queen , my new hive was a nuc from John Pluta . The new one seems much healthier . I think I will stick with Nucs in the future .
     
  15. barry42001

    barry42001 New Member

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    if your seeing web tunnels ni the comb--thats not SHB, beleive is wax moth and they will absolutely kill out a colony, SHB are bad wax moth is left untreated are worse bees can't ge to them inside the webbed tunnels.
    Barry
     
  16. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    this was little larvae crawling through the comb , they left a brown gooey mess of the honey .
    I am too new to be positive what it was . They were skinnier than bee larvae .
     
  17. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    We removed the frames and are feeding sugar water .
    We had acres of blackberry blooming around us , but they are done now .
    All I see right now is Mimosa and Magnolia trees , some little yellow flowers growing everywhere on peoples lawns etc . I don't know what they are .
    It's funny , I never before noticed what blooms when , now it seems very important to know .
    We are in Georgia , I don't know when most flow is .
    You guys are tremendously helpful , thanks
     
  18. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    SHB leave gooey slime. Wax moths leave dry webs like a spider, but thicker.
     
  19. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    wax moth larvae can vary in size somewhat depending on their own diet... some time at the larvae stage the lesser and greater wax moth are confused due to this factor of available food resources. the larvae of the shb is much smaller. quite typically in the demise of a weak hive the shb arrives first and the wax moth just a bit later. almost invariable the wax moth will outcompete the shb and it is this old foe that polishes off a hive.

    luckly freezing frames stops both at the egg stage.
     
  20. tcchris

    tcchris New Member

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    Latest update :
    Our second hive from a nuc , is doing great , growing and growing .
    The original hive , after losing the first queen before eggs , and attack by small hive beetles , we got a new queen .
    New queen was laying , but many of the new bees had deformed wings .
    We did the powdered sugar dusting . Only two varroa ended up on the sticky board , but we also ended up with wax moth larvae . At this point they seem to have the bugs under control , no sign of shb or wax moth , but the queen is gone again . They have made 7 supercedure cells , so we have decided to let them hatch and see how it goes . The hive is very small at this point , but we decided to let them fight it out unless anyone has a valid reason not to . We will try to get a look at the new queens when they hatch , and remove any that have deformed wings . I figure that if they survive all of this , it will end up a very strong hive , if they dont , we will try again next year .