stored equipment and SHB

Discussion in 'Pests and Diseases' started by d.magnitude, Oct 10, 2011.

  1. d.magnitude

    d.magnitude New Member

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    As winter approaches and I've shuffled some frames around, I'm starting to wonder about storing my drawn comb. Last year, I had few enough to cycle them all through the freezer and seal them tight, but I'm not sure if that's going to be practical now.

    This year I've got a bit more, and I'm thinking of using the BT spray (which seems to be endorsed by a few members here), but am wondering if I am going to have a problem with small hive beetles. Do SHB pose a threat to winter-stored comb (I'm assuming "yes"), and does the bt do anything to control them (I'm thinking "no"). What do you bt users do?

    Thanks,
    Dan
     
  2. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    why don't you pm Sundance and ask him if he has any feed back on BT and the small hive beetles???
     

  3. d.magnitude

    d.magnitude New Member

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    Will do.

    In the meantime, if anyone has any experience they can share, let me know.

    Thanks, Dan
     
  4. rast

    rast New Member

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    I have read where some up there just store them covered outside and let nature do the work.
     
  5. Americasbeekeeper

    Americasbeekeeper New Member

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    SHB are not affected by BT. Fresh air and sunshine are good. Protect from mice. ParaDichloroBenzene moth crystals work for wax moths and SHB if concentrated enough.
     
  6. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    other things that work are 1) freezing temperatures (as I think rast has suggested?) and 2) carbon dioxide.
     
  7. d.magnitude

    d.magnitude New Member

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    I think extracted supers would have to be left off the hive during the summer dearth around here, unless it was a really strong colony to protect all that comb (especially when SHB are already present) but I don't want to have to count on that all the time.

    If I had the space, I love the idea of a rack to expose them to sun and air outside, but that's not an option now. I really wanted to avoid PDB crystals. I also really don't want to have a stack of supers in my garage that provide a breeding ground for SHB. I guess that leaves me w/ freezing and bt. This may be the last season I can get away with freezing the amount of comb I have. I still don't get what the bt users do who are living in SHB territory.

    Bt still may be worth having for me in the meantime, as I could use it to offer some protection for comb I leave out in bait hives. I'll have to look into the practicality of CO2, but I imagine it's for bigger operations than little ol' me.

    Thanks for the input guys.
    -Dan
     
  8. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    I haven't tried it with supers, but when I leave comb from cutouts on a shelf in my shed, the shb doesn't bother it once the bees have cleaned it. You may not have a problem with it in a well lighted area and no honey or pollen in it.
     
  9. BjornBee

    BjornBee New Member

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    SHB do not bother dry comb. They thrive in wet supers, dying hives with honey stores, etc.

    While they will focus on pollen to lay eggs, the damage from the larvae is on the wet combs.
     
  10. d.magnitude

    d.magnitude New Member

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    That's what I wanted to hear! I'll go with that (combination of light exposure and bt) for now, and deal with SHB issues (probably via freezing) if/when they arise. I do have some pollen in frames for storage, from the odd frame pulled out of a condensed brood chamber, but they're otherwise dry.

    Thanks again guys,
    -Dan

    ps- I hope I haven't just been fishing for the answer I wanted to hear all along, but I've got to start somewhere. I'm no stranger to learning things the hard way.
     
  11. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    an Iddee snip...
    You may not have a problem with it in a well lighted area and no honey or pollen in it.

    tecumseh:
    it seem to me pollen is more a concern than wet supers in regards to the shb. once cleaned up and most especially if the wax is still yellow you really should have no problems from either wax worms or shb.
     
  12. d.magnitude

    d.magnitude New Member

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    I guess that leads me to the question:
    Any tips on removing pollen from frames that I aim to store?

    I've put frames on hives (above the inner cover) to clean up, but I don't think they've ever move pollen out for me. I guess if it was a small amount, I could cut it out. But I would hate to do that, and hopefully leaving a small amount would not be that much of a threat.

    -Dan
     
  13. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    I don't know about the timing relative to SE Pennsylvania??? Here at this time of year the girls are really hoarding pollen (and sometimes anything that even looks like pollen) in preparation for winter.... so I would likely set the box out standing upright on their front or back and let the girls clean up whatever pollen is left.

    Once freezing weather arrives any threat should be behind you <this doesn't happen here since we can have wax worm throughout the winter months but even here it is relatively unusual to see a shb during the winter months.
     
  14. barry42001

    barry42001 New Member

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    with the cut out I just done, all the comb were extremely dark comb, and SHB were EVERYWHERE, that's why I used a shook swarm technique to try to limit the SHB from being reintroduced into the colony at least for awhile.
     
  15. larry tate

    larry tate New Member

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    Can anyone elaborate on the CO2 method? Thanks
     
  16. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    understand Larry that the following two items are not something I have ever tried myself but were suggested to me by other who supposedly have...

    on the large scale 'potato cellar' (I think primarily in the northwestern section of this country) are filled with supers and then filled with CO2 and then closed up. on a smaller scale open headed barrels are filled with equipment and then filled with CO2 and then closed. CO2 is a heavy gas so the idea would be to have some structure that didn't allow the CO2 to pour out the bottom.
     
  17. Flyman

    Flyman New Member

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    Last fall I tried an experiment with CO2 and stored supers. I stacked them about 8 high and found plastic bags in which the whole thing would fit. I added a timer and valve which would replenish the CO2 atmosphere on a periodic basis. Before initially adding the CO2 atmosphere, I pulled a vacum on the whole thing.

    I found that the CO2 would totally put all wax worms, moths, and shb in stasis, but would not kill them. In other words, as long as the CO2 was good, the insects would be in "suspended animation". However, if the CO2 bottle ran out, the insects revived. So, I ended the experiment and put PDB in the bag.

    Some things to try would be to use a thicker plastic. The poly bags I found were only .7mil. Thinking it probably needs to be at least 2.5 to 3 mil. Use a different bag material such as poly/nylon laminate. The problem being that CO2 molecules are pretty small and tend to migrate through poly. So poly needs an additional barrier to be effective. Sealing the end better. I just "gathered" the end and closed it with a Tywrap.

    Except for the obvious "no chemical" benefit, this is a fairly expensive way to preserve supers.

    Probably a better (but more dangerous) way is to use Phostoxin. Phostoxin drives all oxygen from the area being fumigated and is a restricted use chemical (need a liscense to use it). If have used this to fumigate grain storage bins. It is VERY effective, but it WILL kill you if not properly handled. Definitely not a small time, hobby kind of method.

    I have also used BT from Sundance. It works well, I just can't keep up with what has been sprayed from year to year.
     
  18. tecumseh

    tecumseh New Member

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    flyman writes:
    I found that the CO2 would totally put all wax worms, moths, and shb in stasis, but would not kill them.

    tecumseh:
    very interesting information. thanks for the real life experiment.
     
  19. larry tate

    larry tate New Member

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    Thanks for all the answers. Might try some next yr. I guess the eggs would stay viable?