When adding a frame of eggs/brood to another hive...

Discussion in 'Beekeeping 101' started by BSAChris, Jun 19, 2013.

  1. BSAChris

    BSAChris New Member

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    When adding a frame of eggs/brood to another hive (and assuming the queen isn't on this frame), do you need to get all the bees on the frame off, or can it go in with the bees on?

    I have four hives, 3 thriving and one just not going all that well. There are eggs, but not many; there's lots of brood in there, but not many drawn frames. i was in there today and there are 4 fully drawn frames (both sides) full of nectar and brood and pollen, and very few eggs. A couple of frames with partial comb drawn, with nectar stored in it, and very few eggs. No queen cells, although this hive has over the weeks built and taken down 3 or 4 queen cells that I've seen (maybe more that I haven't seen). It has a feeder on it, but they aren't drinking that down. They're just kind of putzy.

    This was a hive where I killed the queen by accident at installation; requeened 3 days later; everything seemed good after that (about 1 month ago) but it seems to have stalled and is a good 5 frames behind the other colony that I had installed the same day.

    So I'm thinking a full frame of eggs and brood won't hurt, could solve the problem even. Just don't know if I need to brush off the bees, or if they are okay to go in the other hive with the frame.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    Either way works.

    I would also move an empty in one frame inside the outside full ones,
     

  3. BSAChris

    BSAChris New Member

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    Thanks for that, it helps. There are no outside full ones (if outside means the outside positions of the hive) - or do you mean put an empty frame in the middle of the four full ones?
     
  4. Yote Shooter

    Yote Shooter New Member

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    Hey Chris,
    Don't think he meant it that way. You do not want to separate the (brood nest) those four frames in the center. If you get more outer frames drawn and filled then move the outer ones in one slot. They tend to pass up the outermost frames and move up. Then you can move the bare frame in one position and set the stores to the outside, but yet close for their use.

    Hope this helps explain a little bit more.
    Tim
     
  5. BSAChris

    BSAChris New Member

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    I think I understand.
    So if I have my weak brood box like this:

    EEPBBBBPEE
    where E are empty, P are partially drawn, and B have brood and whatnot in them, I might want to end up like this:

    EPNBBBBEPE
    where N is the new frame of brood from the good hive. And one of the partially drawn frames (or fully drawn but without brood) gets shuffled outside a bit.

    ​Did I get it right?
     
  6. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    That's right, except I would make it penbbbbepe, since n is really b.
     
  7. BSAChris

    BSAChris New Member

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    Okay. I will give it a whirl tomorrow, and see what shakes out. Just hope I don't move the queen over - although I suppose that would work itself out anyway. I have a hard time seeing the queens, I can only see one of mine, a very blonde one in one of the stronger hives; otherwise all the other bees look the same to me!
    ​Thanks everyone!
     
  8. ORoedel

    ORoedel New Member

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    Didn´t understand right, you want they push queen cells? Or you only want brood to Strong the colony? In both cases it isn´t correct to put this frame outside the nest. Bees will not keep a brood frame far away from the nest, that means the brood in this frame will die. Put it in the center and the bees will use it. Never divide the broodnest, it´s the "Bien" (german word for the bee-creature a colony forms). Nothing of empty frames, honey combs etc. in the middle of the brood nest, this divides it. In this case you have a full brood comb (?) and you have the right quantity of bees (you have?) to take care of ALL nest combs, even the new one, you could place it in the middle of the nest. If you don´t have bees to cover all brood combs, and the temperatures are low (at night!) you will loose brood and energy...
     
  9. efmesch

    efmesch Active Member

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    Although I'm aware that you can add a frame of brood with or without the accompanying nurse bees, I personally ALWAYS remove all the bees first. There are two reasons why I do it this way:
    1. If the brood has no active bees, then, obviously, I won't accidentally be moving the queen from her hive to another.
    2. Whereas nurse bees are accepted without fighting, I always harbor the fear that not all the bees transferred are nurse bees. There could be field bees included and that might stir up a ruckus.

    When transferring brood in order to strengthen a hive, select the frame with the most advanced cells---sealed cells won't require feeding or attention by the receiving hive and as such, won't tax the abilities of a weak hive to feed and protect them. Then again, advanced brood will emerge soonest and strengthen the hive faster.
     
  10. Iddee

    Iddee New Member

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    ORoedel, the purpose is to make the colony stronger. Look at my posted order and you will see that all brood is together, not split.

    Ef, I agree 100% with your reasoning, but will add that the weakness may be that the colony doesn't have enough bees to cover additional brood, so the queen has cut back laying to accommodate. That is why I try to leave at least some bees on the frame, even tho I may give it a good shake over the donor hive to remove some of them.
     
  11. BSAChris

    BSAChris New Member

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    ORoedel - what Iddee said (thanks Iddee!) - I think you maybe didn't read past my 2nd post there.
     
  12. ORoedel

    ORoedel New Member

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    Sorry Iddee, it´s the age, my vision (or brain) is blurred :grin:
     
  13. BSAChris

    BSAChris New Member

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    No problem Oliver - your points were good, and I'll remember the advice if I am ever tempted to stick an empty in the middle of brood!